Well I don’t know if Kyiv is going to fall tomorrow, but it is obvious there is a lack of…
Orbán in Madrid
Again a meeting of Europe’s extreme right parties took place on Friday and Saturday. Again homeless Orbán not only looked for a new European party, since his FIDESZ left the conservative EPP (European Peoples Party) to avoid being thrown out, but tried to be the centre of a new joint extremist party. This time Vox of Spain (ECR, European Conservatives and Reformists Party) was the host. Vox is a party that is very much of Orbán’s liking, anti-Europe, anti-migrant, anti-feminist, and anti-gay, anti-free-media, and pro-centralist.
Of course Front National was represented by Marine Le Pen, Poland’s PiS by PM Mateusz Morawiecki, and some smaller opposition parties, among them Austrian FPÖ. So much that Orbán in 2019 wanted an EP group of winners, not of losers as Le Pen. German AfD said “we didn’t know about this,” German FAZ reported ►DE. But there were 2 who were not attending: Giorgia Meloni, chairwoman of Fratelli d’Italia (Brothers of Italy,) since 2020 also head of ECR, and Matteo Salvini, Orbán’s hero, chairman of Lega (Nord, the geographical part of the party’s name was eliminated through a parallel founded party to cover that the party was founded to serve the independence of a part of Italy) and founder of ID (Identity and Democracy,) for both parties only subalterns attended for the debate with Orbán. Of course both party leaders stayed in Italy during the elections of the president of the republic, as they belong as members of the chamber of deputies (Meloni) and senator (Salvini) to the 1 009 grandi elettori (great electors.) But already in November Salvini did not attend the failed Warsaw meeting of the far right.
But another ally of Orbán should be mentioned: Romanian AUR. The abbreviation for Alianța pentru Unirea Românilor (Alliance for the Union of Romanians) means gold in Romanian. According to Claudiu Tufis, associate professor of political science at the university of Bucharest explained AUR’s success in the last elections: “AUR played the anti-medicine, anti-vaccination, and anti-restrictions card to a population that is not truly educated in health issues.” ►EN. Already this makes the party a strange ally for Orbán, who always claims that vaccination is the only solution. But much worse! The name of the party and especially of the co-chair, George Simion, is narrowly connected to the 2019 riots in Úzvölgye / Valea Uzului at the military graveyard, where both Hungarians and Romanians were buried. Éva reported in detail about the fire of extremism Orbán’s policy laid and which was happily used by Romanian extremists for a violent escalation ►EN. Simion and his party were actively involved in these riots. Orbán now seeks the alliance of an openly anti-Hungarian party that not only uses debate as political mean, but violence as well. Here an earlier comment about AUR from a Hungarian rightwing paper ►EN. The facts are confirmed by the Euronews article I linked above as well. Péter Márki-Zay pointed out that the slogan of AUR is “Hungarians out of the country” yesterday ►HU. Another Romanian party attended as well, PNȚCD, which translates as National Christian Farmers’ Party. They share with Orbán’s FIDESZ that they have been expelled by EPP.
Again the desired unification of the extreme right didn’t take place. It seemed to be hard to get to a common declaration, especially since Orbán was asked to sign a passage that is critical of Putin. Orbán’s own MTI summarises: “Joint action has been called for in response to external threats to the European Union, be it Russian military activity threatening the eastern border of Europe – which the notice said to be on the brink of war – or immigrants arriving from 3rd countries, migrants and refugees,” reports Magyar Hang ►HU. In opposite to this Le Pen made public that the final declaration has not included any mentioning of Russia, because she (not Orbán!) opposed to this passage 444 knows ►HU.
In the meanwhile the Hungarians are not too happy with the choices of Orbán. Republikon has asked whether Hungarians are happy with the president being elected by parliament, or whether they want to elect the president directly. 60 % answered that they want to elect the president themselves, 32 % would keep today’s mode. And Katalin Novák, FIDESZ candidate for president? 43 % strongly refuse her, 11 % would prefer if she wouldn’t be president, 19 % somehow would like her being president, and only 27 % strongly want her ►HU. With 54 : 46 her refusal is pretty clear, she is definitely not seen as a possible president of all Hungarians, but partisan.
No easy times for Orbán. Trouble with the EU, trouble with his friends, and even his candidate for presidency is not loved by the people.
Voila, the “Council of Judges” (OBT) has already submitted to Orban's "reorganization" by the afternoon. https://obt-jud.hu/sites/default/files/ulesek/Osszefoglalo_2024.11.20.pdf
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Telex ran this article today, https://telex.hu/kulfold/2022/01/30/madrid-jobboldali-partok-nyilatkozat-orban-viktor-oroszorszag-megse-iteltek-el-marine-le-pen, which is not really a retraction of the earlier article it published yesterday. Apparently there is some confusion about what the actual final statement reads. The Telex article concludes with this statement: “In the first version of our article, we wrote that the section on Russia was completely removed from the joint statement, but based on the version published by Le Pen, which is not the official version, Viktor Orbán’s signature is also included. We clarified our article and asked Viktor Orbán’s spokesman which version was valid.”
Magyar Nemzet in its article today simply avoided the issue of the joint statement. see https://magyarnemzet.hu/kulfold/2022/01/orban-viktor-bekes-megoldasra-van-szukseg-ukrajna-kapcsan
This article https://magyarnemzet.hu/kulfold/2022/01/madridi-kiallas-magyarorszag-es-lengyelorszag-mellett does discuss the joint statement, but it does not directly quote it. Here is my translation of what it says about the section of the joint statement in question: “They called for joint action on the external threats facing the European Union, be it Russian military activity threatening Europe’s eastern border, which, according to the communication, is on the brink of war, or immigrants, migrants and asylum seekers from third countries.”
It appears that the statement citing Russia as a threat to Europe was not retracted and the claim of Europe being on the brink of war remains and it is Russia that is pushing that war clearly. Magyar Nemzet today significantly reduced its anti-United States rhetoric too and reigned in some of its pro-Russian writers for the day.
The Russians in their RT news service do not discuss this joint statement or even the Madrid conference at all today. But in fact carries a story based on comments by Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov conceding NATO will not agree to limit expansion of NATO nor pull back military forces from Central Europe. (see https://www.rt.com/russia/547633-moscow-compromise-security-guarantees/).
Klára Dobrev, MEP from DK a few days ago gave an interview to Klubradio where she discussed how Orban was using the Hungarian speaking population of Ukraine as sort of a political cover for supporting Putin. The full discussion can be heard here https://www.klubradio.hu/adasok/dobrev-orbanek-putyin-kis-szolgaloikent-kihasznaljak-az-ukrajnai-magyarokat-123841 .
I found this part of her interview very interesting, she said “when President Putin puts a proposal on the table that would effectively tear Hungary out of the Euro-Atlantic alliance to which we belong. And the Hungarian Foreign Minister has not reacted loudly No way.” Dobrev went on to say: “We are living in the most tense period in decades. We Hungarians have made it very clear where we want to belong to Western Europe, we want to be part of NATO, and even Fidesz voters think we belong there .”
As we all know Lajos Simicska was not the only Fidesz follower who was hostile to Russia. There are many Fidesz voters who saw Orban as a young hero for calling for the removal of Russian forces from Hungarian soil no matter how corrupt he turned out to be. A line of attack by the opposition on Orban being a lackey of Putin could clearly erode some of that support and Klára Dobrev is correct to fully attack on this issue. Orban is egy szikla és egy kemény hely közé szorult and it is delightful to watch.
In addition to this: Unity for Hungary proposed to add to the basic law a clause that Hungary mustn’t leave EU or NATO without referendum. International treaties are right now expressively excluded from holding a referendum about. Of course they know that the population in the vast majority for these memberships.
Thanks Istvan. I was in Hungary when the “young” Orban demanded that Soviet troops leave Hungary. How ironic that the “older” Orban is now an enabler of Russia, especially a Russia ruled by a former KGB agent.
The recently deceased Stephen Cohen, long considered the foremost Russian expert in the United States, repeatedly disabused on TV who advanced the idea that today’s Russia is just Soviet Union 2.0.
If you want to see it for yourself, go to YouTube and watch the vast library of interviews with Cohen, starting with the one where he debated neo-con Max Boot on this very subject.
In that light, I do not think it is ‘ironic’, Misi, that Orban has shifted positions on Russia, because this Russia is not the Soviet Union of Andropov, Brezhnev, Kruschev, and it certainly is not that of Stalin.
Go back to your black hole, this is misinformation.
Cohen was not abused; he was an admirer of Putin. Defended the Russian aggression against Ukraine.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/meet-stephen-f-cohen-vladimir-putins-best-friend-in-the-american-media
If you do not like Stephen Cohen, Jan, then you can go to YouTube and watch the seminar given by Vladimir Posner, former Soviet spokesman in the US, who says much the same thing – that Putin’s Russia NOT Soviet Union 2.ö
Moreover, Posner, not an admirer of Putin, goes on to say that the West is to blame for the existence of Vladimir Putin.
As to Black Holes – those are only reserved for those who cannot tolerate any opinion other than their own.
Things are different in different times. The French 5th republic sees itself in the tradition of the 1st republic, but in fact it is highly different. It is just the tradition of a republic system. Putin himself wants to create the same kind of hegemonic power with a dictatorial regime as the Soviet Union was. And he doesn’t hide that! In Belarus and Central Asia Putin he has a couple of regimes that happily serve this desire. The opposite in Ukraine or the Baltic states. In this sense Russia is definitely not a Soviet Union 2.0, since it remains beyond the former borders already, not to mention the former satellites in Eastern Europe, perhaps with the exclusion of Hungary. So there are enough differences, but who looks behind these obvious differences in the core the similarities are very surprising. And to avoid the usual discussion: Putin is as far away from Marx as Stalin or Andropov were. They are / were just selfish dictators.
My father managed to get out of USSR in 1920s and come to US. I was able to help my remaining relatives leave Ukraine for Germany after the 1990s. My time in USSR as it collapsed and visiting successor states such as Ukraine was a valuable education. I recommend a visit for your edification. So I don’t need “YouTube”, as I have experienced first hand how Russia today remains an authoritarian and lawless society.
Were’t you the bloke who was peddling anti-vaxer bs just a few days ago, something about requiring at least 8 years of testing bfore it could be considered safe; and now this. Perhaps you are the new improved Zoli 2.0.
Yes, she is the anti-vaxxer. And she has a new IP. This one is flagged as being suspicious. It is geographically in Hungary, but owned by a US provider. Scamanalytics tells about this provider: fraud score 62. The scale from 0 to 100 with high numbers showing high risks. Hungarian.news has a fraud score of 0, my private Hungarian provider (as I have no static IP) has a 6. She is careful now, since I had to edit her 1st 3 comments as not being according to the community rules. I do not tolerate propaganda about using a worm cure for animals by humans or for anything else but deworming for example. How this fits to 8 years testing is another question. She remains under supervision, can’t post without moderation. As long as she posts about different opinions about Russia for example I’ll give it a go, revealing her sources as “Putyin pincsi” is the consequence.
So it’s she and not a bloke; or is that you doing the Hungarian gender confusion thing? 😉
OT, but perhaps you can help me with something. I’m a dual citizen and would very much like to vote in the upcoming election (in Hungary). How do I register and get ballot papers without contacting the consulate in Canberra?
Phil, sex change is forbidden under Orbán! The name used in the email address is definitely female – including Hungarian spelling. Since Stevan Harnad was right that princess Aida was an “increasingly grumpy old man,” who rejoined HS once as David, I can’t exclude that she could be a he as well.
For voting from abroad without Hungarian address you can register here: https://www.valasztas.hu/kerelmek-magyarorszagi-lakcimmel-nem-rendelkezoknek
I wasn’t talking about a groin rearrangement (sex change), just to the Hungarian linguistic propensity to confuse gender when speaking English, my mother got it wrong more often than not as did/do most of the older (than me) Hungarians that I know here, even though they’ve lived here for 50 plus years.
Odd, I never thought of Aida as anything other than a grumpy old man, I thought he was an opera not a princess. I knew he was later David, this became obvious to me during our longish debate about George Pell. I later baited him with questions about Dobrev and Apro, he knew that I knew who he was and went silent (with me); but later on he couldn’t help himself and Eva gave him the flick.
This Smuel person is not Aida; For all his flaws, Aida was quite bright and spoke (wrote) excellent English, his and would never have been a Putin apologist. This one’s “style” is completely different.
More importantly, thank you for the voting information; I was plesantly surprised that it is also in English. While I speak Hungarian without an accent, (if you met me, it would take you a while to realise that I’m not a local) my vocabulary is quite poor.
Sorry for joking. No, technically I don’t have problems using the right personal pronouns, at least not regarding persons, I grew up with both several languages and grammatical gender. Just things sometimes have different grammatical genders in different languages, so automobi(e)l is male in Dutch, female in French, and neuter in German. So I might confuse things in English, but not persons.
And Aida? An opera about an Ethiopian princess called Aida at the Egyptian court, not about an grumpy old man called David. And I am pretty sure Aida/David sent me a mail, his typical expressions were used and the style very much liked on him, but I would never expect that these comments here now could be written by Aida/David hiding behind another name. I just reminded to him as example that a man can hide behind a female name as well.
Do you remember the analysis of Éva that Orbán’s demand that Soviet troops should leave was just something he got knowledge of short before as already agreed fact, and he promised to keep silence about, but broke that promise? All the FIDESZ stories that Orbán sent the Russians home in his own are completely invented. But he fetched them back alone. And the differences between the Soviet Union of 1989 and Russia of today is that the Soviet Union of those days was already an imploding giant, while the Russia of today is going back to the days of “former glory” – or should I say former dictatorial suppression regime?
You are correct Istvan on all details. Thank you.
Regarding Romanian AUR, according to Wikipedia they are Magyarophobic (not to mention homophobic, devout Christians and anti-medicine/vaccine) so when it comes to this rejection of the Hungarian minority from Transylvania I cannot help but wonder how AUR could be a real ally of Orbán?
A short precision, Marine Le Pen’s political party is now called Rassemblement National (RN) but while the name might have changed, it’s still the same ideology if you disregard the fact that Marine Le Pen has changed her views on many subjects over time to better match populist aspirations. For instance, economic/social policy-wise, RN is rather on the left to attract voters with lower income; sovereignty and immigration-wise, they are still a far-right party.
I have my doubt whether Orbán could ever be decent in the choice of his allies. Siding with Putin is absolutely not wanted by the people, the old ones know why, the young ones know the stories. It is the same as the huge common wish to stay member of EU through all parts of the population including FIDESZ. If Orbán is convinced that AUR would be good for his European ambitions he will accept them as allies and tell his press not to mention.
Of course you are right, the extreme right is trying to be more accepted by changing aggressive or separatist sounding names, Front National, Lega Nord and Vlaams Blok are just eating chalk by using Gathering instead of Front, dropping the region they want independence for, or changing Block against Interest.